Gen 5 Glock 23 vs. HK USPc40 vs. HK P2000 40 S&W

[David]

On a .357 Sig note: Yeah - too rare, too expensive, and just not Uber-effective enough compared to .40, .45 whatever, to justify on any practical level. Just for shooting fun and personal interest? Yeah. You need one, though, not three.

Well apparently you're not familiar with all the experts on Glock Talk that have, for 88 pages, shouted the merits of the 357sig. It provides;

• Lightning incapacitation

• Knock down power

• Kinetic energy dump

• Damages internal organs that it doesn't even touch just because of the massive energy wave it produces.

Get onboard the velocity junkie train Bob!

[Bob]

Are you sure you didn't misread a 10mm thread? LOL

[David]

Are you sure you didn't misread a 10mm thread? LOL

Oh no, I'm quite sure it's the 357sig thread in Caliber Corner. It's become a complete joke.

See here's the way I look at it. I like 40 S&W. Not because I attribute some magical or mystical characteristic to it for stopping bad guys...I just like the caliber. I think that with today's modern ammunition that all service calibers are about the same in terminal effectiveness. There are no service calibers that are head-n-shoulders above the rest of the pack. So I'm okay with liking 40 S&W simply because I like the round. If you're a 9mm guy that likes 9mm simply because 9mm has a lot of positive qualities then I can get on board with that line of thinking as well.

What I take issue with is someone coming out and saying (insert caliber here) is the best because it delivers 'lightning incapacitation' or 'massive energy dump' or any of the other discredited psuedo-science babble that you see on gun forums. Because some newbie is going to see that and make a decision based on that crap that may not be right for them.

[David]

I posted some of this in the Glock thread but wanted to discuss it here as well. As much as I previously wanted a Glock 23 in Gen 5, those photos have reinforced my decision to stick with the HK USPc in 40 S&W (and also 357sig). The difference in width in those photos are fairly significant. I suppose it needs it to be that thick to improve the design and that's fine. But it also brings up the question of weight. There was a very slight increase in weight from the Gen 3 to the Gen 4 pistols. My guess would be because of the dual RSA. But the difference in thickness of the Gen 5 40 S&W models, as noted, is fairly significant. This would translate into possibly a significant increase in weight. As noted in the OP, that increase is supposedly 3 ounces. That puts the difference in weight between the G23.5 and the HK USPc at 4 ounces or less. And a difference in 1mm in slide thickness at current estimates.

For me, I think I made the right decision to forego the Glock in favor of the HK.

[ratf51]

It also looks thick enough to make holsters incompatible. A leather rig might be able to stretch and accommodate but a kydex would not. I'll just keep my gen4 23.

[David]

It also looks thick enough to make holsters incompatible. A leather rig might be able to stretch and accommodate but a kydex would not. I'll just keep my gen4 23.

If the finger grooves work for you then yes, I think staying with the Gen 4 is the wise thing to do. It really looks substantially thicker in those photos and I've seen the holster fit as a big concern in other discussions. For me, I just see sticking with the HK as the best/wisest thing to do. Don't have to worry about holsters and it's already set up the way I want it. I'll take the additional 4 ounces of weight to have it hammer-fired with a safety/decocker which is my personal preference.

[ratf51]

The finger grooves are not an issue for me. At least, not yet. I am still mulling the option of getting a 9mm conversion barrel for the 23 in order to transition to 9 as my primary round. I won't go any further with that until ammo supply comes back. I have plenty of 40S&W for 2 pistols (a 22.3 and the 23.4) but not enough 9mm. I have enough to be comfortable with only the 1 9mm (P365) but not enough for 2.

[David]

I very much recommend the 9mm conversion barrel. Just makes a lot of sense to make the pistol more versatile. Prices will begin to normalize a few months after Trump's second inauguration. The riots will have been put down at that point and people will start to relax. Supply, which is in overtime right now will catch up and surpass demand. Then it will be time to stock up again and go deep.

[ratf51]

Yes, it's a waiting game right now. I can wait. Don't like it, but I can.

[David]

Yes, it's a waiting game right now. I can wait. Don't like it, but I can.

Any thoughts on a 357sig barrel? Although this isn't a primary caliber for me I have noticed that it's been available some places online and on Armslist for really about the same price as pre-panic. I've slowly started building up the stock for it as a tertiary caliber. I've got a 357sig barrel for both the USPc and the P2000. If I came across one for the G22 that was a deal I might pick that up as well just because.