A general discussion area for topics not specifically covered elsewhere on the board. NO politics. If the topic would fit it a specific section please post in that specific section.
Mac66 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 25, 2021 9:16 am
Fortunately both of us are grandfathered under the old system. People retiring today don't get the same benefits as we did.
Same here. When I started, sworn members had to put in 25 years or age 55. This was when we were predominately 8-hour shifts. Years ago, under Governor Scott (who is now one of our Senators) it was changed to 30 years. And for the last 12 years we've been on 12-hour shifts. And before the Sheriff contributed 100% to retirement, now it's around 95%. It's still a good deal if you live long enough, but that's the rub. When it was 25 years & 8-hour shifts you saw maybe 25% reach retirement. The rest moved, changed careers, fired, or whatever. And 25 years in that type of stressful environment can take a toll. The move to 30 years & 12-hour shifts was a means to reduce the number of people that actually make it to retirement thus saving the state money in the long run.
Years ago, when the previous Sheriff was moving the entire Bureau to 12-hour shifts there was a staff vote to leave one division on 8-hour shifts. Supposedly it was voted down but it was probably manipulated. At any rate, all the new people voted for 12-hour shifts. This was because on 8-hour shifts they wouldn't see weekends off for years but on 12's they'd get every other weekend off. Good deal for them right? Also a smack in the face for those with seniority that had put their time in the trenches. I was sitting with a bunch of rookies at lunch one day after the vote and they were all happy that all divisions were 12-hour shifts because they could transfer anywhere and still get their weekends. I told them all that they were short-sighted and had royally screwed themselves. They scoffed so I explained how many reached retirement when it was 25/8 and now they were all committed to 30/12. I explained that on 12-hour shifts that rotate you can't go to college or even join a bowling league. They cut off the one means of having a stable shift if needed/desired. I then explained that the move to 30/12 was meant to reduce the number of people that made it to retirement and that no one at the table would, in all likelihood, ever reach retirement. So all the benefits would never be enjoyed. It sobered them up quite a bit. The stress and dangers of the job are just too much to work 30 years at 12-hours a day. Of course the brass kept themselves on a standard 8-hour shift with weekends off.
A man cannot call himself peaceful if he is not capable of violence. If he's not capable of violence he isn't peaceful, he is harmless. There is a distinct difference.
Fate whispers to the warrior "You cannot weather this storm". The warrior replies, "I am the storm".
I worked a couple stints of 12 hours shifts for about a year once. It was murder. Most departments in Michigan retire at 25 and out. Many have gone to 4/10 hour shifts.
But I retired as a college administrator (director of public safety) not as a cop. I had 4 years to go to make 30 years but the state was offering a retirement incentive and was switching to a new formula to determine benefits as of July 1st. They were also reducing medical benefits and the amount they were paying into the fund. Bottom line is that you would have to work longer and contribute more for less medical and other benefits. If you went out under the old system you kept everything as is. If you stayed you went under the new system as of that time. Then the college I worked for offered an early out incentive, $100K spread over the next 7 years.
I hadn't planned on retiring and only had two weeks to make a decision. Took it to my financial advisor and he figured out that if I bought the additional 4 years (to get a full 30 year pension), the incentive and reduction in state benefits would more than pay for the bought years. The job was really stressful at that time after just having a shooting/murder on campus. My department did a good job handling it but was under constant, relentless scrutiny from the college community and the lawyers.
So I bailed. It was a very difficult transition. I suffered nightmares and separation anxiety terribly. About a year later the nightmares tapered off, I stopped dreaming about going to work every night, all the lawsuits etc were dropped and I started enjoying my retirement.
I understand about the dreams. I still dream about work. Often it's busy and chaotic. Fortunately the dreams are getting fewer and far between. I was and have been very blessed with being grandfathered in. My medical/dental/life continued with no interruption or reduction. And in fact, FRS gives $5 for every credited year of service towards medical so I'm actually paying less for the same coverage.
A man cannot call himself peaceful if he is not capable of violence. If he's not capable of violence he isn't peaceful, he is harmless. There is a distinct difference.
Fate whispers to the warrior "You cannot weather this storm". The warrior replies, "I am the storm".
Heck, did almost 33yrs here... when I maxed out my pension
first third+, rotating 8hr shifts ( 8x4,4x12,12x8 )... that was hard!
Later the 12hr shifts came for either nights or days but had enough seniority to pick days... not a bad shift tho 12 hrs long. We did 3 tours and then off for 4 ( with make up extra day for the missing hrs every third week )... that was nice.
At the last third in Dets, it was 4-9hrs with days then next week evenings ( make up days now and then for extra hrs ).... not bad either.
Since I started at 21, I was able to finish at a good age... retirement for newer guys changed over the years but I was in a good position when my time came. Still, we had limits compared to the older guys... Our pension was base on last 5 yrs...the fifth yr out was your base number and then you couldn't make more than ( for retirement ) 20% of each prev year as you got closer to leaving. ( older guys had a choice for retirement of best 3 yrs or last year , so many were able to work double the last yr to maximize their pension ) It was hard to work all the extra over the 5 yrs.
But still no complaints here.
Funny you mention dreams... still dream now and then I'm working... and been gone for 13 now.
- Not good ina financial sense, but also very adaptive in a over 10/15/20 years of thing change sense.
I generally don't feel it is a "good thing" to be old, but I will say that for many of you it does not appear to be a bad thing. That said - the solvency of retirement funds whether company or government backed does change. Good luck there!
The question on FRS is what is the rate of payout - #people x amount average x expected years they will be paid, and the rate of new people coming in
vs
Amount being put in/grown annually and the rate at which new people come in.
MOST retirement/pension systems did not foresee people getting paid as much as they are for as long as they are. There are a number that have gone broke. There are a number that are known to be insolvent at a date certain.
Bob wrote: ↑Sat Feb 27, 2021 10:21 pm
I am 54 and have no concept of retirement.
I generally don't feel it is a "good thing" to be old, but I will say that for many of you it does not appear to be a bad thing.
What's the alternative to being old?
My dad kind of ingrained in us the idea of retiring early and enjoying life. He always said..."pay yourself first" i.e, take a certain percentage of whatever you make and stash it away. That could mean investments or whatever. He retired at 55. My older brother retired at 55. My wife did her 30 and retired at 52. I retired at 56. My younger brother and his wife both retired last year at 62 though they could have retired earlier. Now that they have been retired they said they should have gone earlier.
I always considered it a kind of a prepper thing. Prepare not only to survive but to enjoy life. I now have enough time and money to do whatever the hell I want. That's pretty liberating. Unfortunately I am now considered elderly (age 66) though I am in better health and shape than I was 10-15 years ago. We'll have to see how that goes.
And the prepare enjoy is a big part of my deal too. I am not all about the end of the world. Most days, it simply isn't that. So I make sure my prepping enhances everyday life.
A big question is of course, how old do you expect to live? My Dad finally went down at 87 from Pancreatic Cancer. Assuming he grew up both healthier (no processed foods) yet worse - smoking/no exercise, lets call me even.
I've got 30 more years to go. But - following his pattern...I expect I'll be spry enough for writing, content creation, consulting, music, and martial arts. I have started monetizing all of that. But a lot of that requires work, but isn't work.
My dad died at 92 after suffering a stroke 4 years earlier. My mother is 94. I'm 66 and in good health. I don't expect to last another 30 years. Maybe 25, probably closer to 20. Notice i didnt say "if i'm lucky" Seeing what my dad went through and what my mom and in-laws are going through in their mid 90s im not sure I want to go there. Stuff doesn't work anymore, they are all just plain wore out.
Last edited by Mac66 on Tue Mar 02, 2021 4:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
You never know. My dad went when he was 89. From him, I tried to learn to downsize, get rid of projects in progress that never get finished.
My mother passed at age 52. She was correct. The next wife got the money and the trips to Europe. My wife died at age 40. She suffered for the last few years, but she had done the traveling.
I am 74. Not on any medications. No underlying medical conditions. My days are spent exercising, studying. It is a great day when I accomplish all of the exercises.
Studying:
1. I have approximately 60 books piled up in English and French to read. It will take me about another 5-8 years to finish them. The shutdown of the public library encouraged me to buy used books. REading the Adventures of Augie March now. Recently read Einstein's theories.
2. I have a language lesson every day.
3. I have multiple skills videos and I would like to watch more than one a day. Everything from knots to car repairs.
I have two retired brothers. One is a competitive swimmer who travels all over. The other is very active socially in his church.
You don't have to stay working to find meaning in life.
