What did Uvalde teach us about the police?

[Bob]

I guess this is political?

I know there are officers/former officers he that will support the "Few bad apples theory" but I think Uvalde is a really good example of exactly how reality works.

ALL of the responders there were bad apples. Not only did they fail to take decisive action in the face of an active shooter in a school - they have mysteriously all been silent. And they are doing that in the face of a very obvious set of lies and public cover up of the events.

In fact - they actually detained parents who were law enforcement, who did go against the grain and attempt to enter the building.

So when you thing US Soldiers won't fire on US Citizens - remember - Police tried to stop their own, and did not take action.

Which brings us back to Prepping 101: Be prepared to defend your self, and your family, including your children. Because there were not "just a few bad apples" at Uvalde.

I'm sure I'll get "Bob - you don't understand chain of command" yet people will turn around and say "I'd have disobeyed those orders" or some such such foolishness. Well, there were a lot of people there...and guess what? Nope. And now they aren't even talking about it. But yeah...its "Just a few"

[Mac66]

What's the old saying..."fools rush in where angels fear to tread"

I'm not defending the responders but you have to have a plan and some organization in place when responding to these types of situations otherwise its a free for all. Letting more armed guys into a situation when you don't know who and how many suspects doesn't make much sense.

Do you think the police were all cowards for not responding? Dead responders don't help anyone.

Or....are you suggesting there was/is an ulterior motive for not going in when they did?

When I was teaching Critical Incidence Management/Active Shooter Response there were 7 Critical Tasks...

1. Establish control and communications (first on the scene has to take initial control/command of the scene and let others know what's what
2. Identify the hot zone
3. Establish an inner perimeter (contain the situation)
4. Establish an outer perimeter (control the situation, limit access by outsiders)
5. Establish a command post (who's in charge and where are they)
6. Establish a staging area (Where is everyone meeting, where does equipment go)
7. Determine and request resources (environmental, tactical, etc, etc)

All of the above takes time particularly in fluid situation at a location as large as a school.

[Bob]

If that were the case, then why not simple say that was done?
- Answer, because it wasn't. I agree - running in guns a blazing is a no no.\

Next - if that were the case, the amount of time it really took....was way longer than that.
- When parents are arriving and trying to get in, and you are busy detaining them and not going in yoursef?

Finally
- Cover up cover up cover up.

In the first few minutes, yeah, I get it. But then at a certain point...no excuses. everyone there has something to answer for.

But like I said - the lesson here...don't depend on them.

[Mac66]

"Finally
- Cover up cover up cover up."

Covering up what exactly?

What they did or didn't do is open for all to see, analyze, interpret, comment on and criticize.

[Bob]

HAve we all watched the film? You know, the one with the children's screams removed?

[bdcochran]

1. taught nothing new about police or other humans. some people make mistakes.

[G29Guy]

HAve we all watched the film? You know, the one with the children's screams removed?

Everyone should watch it with the full audio…

[bdcochran]

"But like I said - the lesson here...don't depend on them."

Not able to say it any better.

This applies to all endeavors - obtaining healthcare services, receiving orders in the military, going to an appointment.

You carry a pocket knife, you check that enough oil was put in after the oil change, you carry a pad and pen when your visit a doctor or lawyer or dentist or auto mechanic, you take a book with you to go to an appointment in case the other person is late . . late . . late.

I knew my Top Sarge from WW2 knew more about combat than the newly minted 2nd Lt. from UCLA.

Sometimes, you just have to violate instructions and orders to deal with situations requiring situational awareness - and take the consequences .

[Bmyers]

I agree that sometimes you have to break the rules, but you also have to be willing to face the consequences as you noted.

Many years ago I responded on an EMS call. The man was dying and he was going downhill quickly. I knew there was nothing we could do for him. He wanted his wife of 49 years to ride in the back of the ambulance with him, which was against policy. I made a decision and they got to spend his last few minutes on earth together and by the time we arrived at the hospital he had passed.

I got the biggest hug and thank you from her.

I also got a write-up and had a to meet with management. At the end of the meeting, after being lectured on the importance of following the rules, blah, blah, blah, the manager stood up and ripped the write-up in half and threw it in the trash.

He said they followed the policy and I was disciplined and that was the end of the matter.

Not every rule breaking has such a positive outcome, but regardless you have to do what is right and be ready to face up to it.

[Mac66]

I agree that sometimes you have to break the rules, but you also have to be willing to face the consequences as you noted.

Break the rules like carrying concealed in a store, mall, school that has a no guns allowed sign? Concealed is concealed.