Survival and Emergency Preparedness

I got this Savage Model 720 when my dad died. The 720 is a licensed copy of the Browning Auto 5 which is a 5 shot semi auto. The Auto 5 was designed by John Browning and offered to Remington in 1902 who declined it. Browning sold it to FN in Belgium whose been making them ever since. In 1905 Browning licensed Remington to make it in the US as the Model 11 who made them up until 1947. Prior to WWII, they were also licensed to Savage who made them for use by the army for home guard defense and to train bomber gunners. Savage made them until 1949. This one was made in 1947 and bought new by my dad.



It is pretty worn as he hunted with it a lot but still runs like a top. I always called it "the beast" as it is quite heavy. One interesting thing about these is that the whole barrel moves back into the receiver during recoil.

Another cool thing about these guns is that you can put an extended mag tube from a Rem 870/1100 on them to increase the capacity. As such guys have been buying up old Model 11s and 720s and converting them into defense shotguns. In that they are 70+ years old and in poor condition. They can still be found at reasonable prices. The 720s are typically worth less than the Remington. In it's present condition my dad's 720 is probably only worth $150-175.

I have a +2 mag extension off an old 870 I no longer use so I tried it on my 720. It works but I didn't want to cut down the barrel on my dad's gun.

Recently a shotgun advertised as a Remington Model 11 came up for sale on a local gun forum. I went and looked at it. It was in immaculate condition so I snatched it up for $250. When I got it home I looked at it closer. Turns out not to be an 11 but a variation called a "Sportsman". This one came with a "Polychoke" adjustable choke on it.



The "Sportsman" was 3 shot version of the 11 but came with a shorter tube, hand guard and a different tube cap. It cannot be converted to take more than 3 rounds without replacing the whole magazine tube assembly including hand guard and cap. There are not many if any of those available for a 70+ year old gun. If I can even find one it likely would cost more than the gun.

The good news is that the barrel off the Sportsman will fit on the 720. With the extended tube I could swap the barrels and cut the Sportsman bbl down. That would give me a 7 shot semi auto with an 18" bbl.

The 720 with the tube extension and the Sportsman barrel. I marked the barrel where it would be cut if/when I decide.



I'll take both shotguns up to my property and run some shells through them with the barrels swapped and using the mag extension before/if I decide to cut down the Sportsman's barrel.

The end result hopefully will be a 7 shot semi auto shotgun I can re-purpose into a self defense shotgun with ruining it's sentimental value and a 3 shot hunting shotgun.

The A5/11/720 are good reliable shotguns but I swear Browning designed a recoil amplifier in them.

JDH wrote: ↑Fri Sep 04, 2020 12:05 pm The A5/11/720 are good reliable shotguns but I swear Browning designed a recoil amplifier in them.

I thought it was just me who thought that. LOL. That's another reason I always called my dad's "The Beast".

And just an aside, they were commonly used by law enforcement and criminals. Bonnie and Clyde had one of them in their car (it was chopped down at both ends) when they were killed. The Dillinger gang used at least two of them.

There was also a riot gun version made for police and military. It used the same 5 shot mag but with a shorter bbl.

The system is designed to amplify recoil. That whole barrel slamming backwards can be brutal.

First thought was "Old Browning". Then "Ouch"

LOL

The A5 may be a beast but it's been in production since 1903. That's 117 years! They're still being made so someone still likes them

BTW, I found a 5 shot 720 mag tube on ebay at a reasonable price (so far) that I'm bidding on. There is also a A5 barrel, I'm keeping an eye on. Price is low currently but I'm sure it will jump out of sight the closer it gets to the end of bidding.

Mac66 wrote: ↑Sat Sep 05, 2020 9:13 am The A5 may be a beast but it's been in production since 1903. That's 117 years! They're still being made so someone still likes them

Let's be fair here, it was in almost continuous production for the better part of a century. There were a handful of gaps when it changed companies and countries of origin. It fell out of popularity long ago when gas operated guns became common.
The newer A5 of the last few years is not even close to the same design. It's just a nostalgic nod to the old gun.

Ronin.45 wrote: ↑Sat Sep 05, 2020 11:40 am

Mac66 wrote: ↑Sat Sep 05, 2020 9:13 am The A5 may be a beast but it's been in production since 1903. That's 117 years! They're still being made so someone still likes them

Let's be fair here, it was in almost continuous production for the better part of a century. There were a handful of gaps when it changed companies and countries of origin. It fell out of popularity long ago when gas operated guns became common.
The newer A5 of the last few years is not even close to the same design. It's just a nostalgic nod to the old gun.

Okay, I was wrong. I thought the current A5 was the same gun as the old A5. Apparently they stopped making the old A5 in 1998.

So let's go there......

From what I've found in my research it was designed by Browning in 1898 and patented in 1900. The design was sold to FN in 1902 after Winchester turned it down and the president of Remington died of a heart attack during negotiations. FN licensed Remington to make it in the US as the model 11 in 1905. Production of the FN/Browning Auto-5 in Belgium continued until the start of World War II, when Browning moved production to Remington in the United States. The Auto-5 was produced by Remington alongside the Model 11 until FN could resume making the gun after the war. My research also says it was made it continuously by Remington until 1947. Savage licensed it from FN/Browning and made it from 1930-1948. Browning made it up until 1998.

I would imagine production stopped in Belgium during WWI as well but I can't find any mention of that. As far as I can tell production was continuous by Remington since they started making it and throughout the world wars and throughout WWII by Savage. So no real gaps in production as far as I can tell. It was in continuous production for 95 years and well after gas operated shotguns came into vogue. I would say that's a pretty good design.

Mac66 wrote: ↑Sat Sep 05, 2020 1:18 pm

Ronin.45 wrote: ↑Sat Sep 05, 2020 11:40 am

Mac66 wrote: ↑Sat Sep 05, 2020 9:13 am The A5 may be a beast but it's been in production since 1903. That's 117 years! They're still being made so someone still likes them

Let's be fair here, it was in almost continuous production for the better part of a century. There were a handful of gaps when it changed companies and countries of origin. It fell out of popularity long ago when gas operated guns became common.
The newer A5 of the last few years is not even close to the same design. It's just a nostalgic nod to the old gun.

Okay, I was wrong. I thought the current A5 was the same gun as the old A5. Apparently they stopped making the old A5 in 1998.

So let's go there......

From what I've found in my research it was designed by Browning in 1898 and patented in 1900. The design was sold to FN in 1902 after Winchester turned it down and the president of Remington died of a heart attack during negotiations. FN licensed Remington to make it in the US as the model 11 in 1905. Production of the FN/Browning Auto-5 in Belgium continued until the start of World War II, when Browning moved production to Remington in the United States. The Auto-5 was produced by Remington alongside the Model 11 until FN could resume making the gun after the war. My research also says it was made it continuously by Remington until 1947. Savage licensed it from FN/Browning and made it from 1930-1948. Browning made it up until 1998.

I would imagine production stopped in Belgium during WWI as well but I can't find any mention of that. As far as I can tell production was continuous by Remington since they started making it and throughout the world wars and throughout WWII by Savage. So no real gaps in production as far as I can tell. It was in continuous production for 95 years and well after gas operated shotguns came into vogue. I would say that's a pretty good design.

I'm certainly not downplaying the significance of the gun. Any design that lasts a century is pretty damn impressive. I just wanted to clarify for anyone unfamiliar with the Auto-5 that it's been out of production for a while and the new A5 is completely different. If someone shot an A5 they'd think we were nuts for talking about the recoil like we have.

And just to clarify that I mistaken about the mag tube capacity. The Savage holds 4 in the tube, the Sportsman holds 2 in the tube, 3 total with one in the chamber. I could have sworn the Savage held 5 when I had it up at my property earlier this summer.

So with the +2 mag extension the Savage will hold 6 in the tube. I could probably use a +3 and cut the bbl to 20". I'll have to look into that.