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Why Does everyone love AR15s?
#1
The title is semi rhetorical.

As I've mentioned, I spend a lot of time on Redditt these days, in the survival, bug out, prepper, offgrid and gun forums.

Regardless of which sub it's in, about every 2 weeks someone will post a 'what gun should I buy for home defense' thread. 

And, without fail, 95% of the replies are AR15    4% of the replies are 'shotgun' and 1% are something reasonable like a revolver or a glock


What in the hell. 

Please, SOMEONE explain to me why an AR15 is a better home defense gun for an  22 year old girl, with limited gun experience, who lives alone in a 700 sq ft apartment, than a $150 shotgun or a $200 revolver?

to me, it makes no sense on literally any account.

Cost. 
LAST-AR15.  - even if you built it, which someone with no gun experience WOULD do.. I'll be generous and call it $400
WINNER-vs an NEF 12g from Academy for $150
WINNER-high point 45cal    $150
Second-tarus 9mm $300
Second-Kahr    $300

Ease of maneuvering
Tie for last -Even with a tele stock, an AR15 with a 14.5 barrel and muzzle break is going to be a LOT longer/heavier/harder to move around 
Tie for last-Shotgun
Winner-- ANY pistol. 

Ease of training. This is a matter of opinion:
tie for second  -Shotgun, insert shell, rack side, pull trigger
last               -AR-15. Load magazine, insert mag, flip safety, line up sites, seat on shoulder. pull trigger
Winner          -Tarus 38sp Revolver-put bullets in cylinder. pull trigger
tie for second    -Semi auto pistol (without safety, like a glock or kahr).  Load bullets into mag, put mag in gun, rack slide, pull trigger.

Over penetration:
Armchair delta force apparently refuses to go to Boxotruth.com and look at the hard, real world data about what bullets will go through what wall.

223.  -yes
9mm-yes
12g-yes
22LR -yes
hollow points- yes
frangiable ammo -yes
32acp -yes

The website basically boils down a fact which is that if the bullet doesn't have enough push to go through drywall, it doesn't have enough push to get into vital organs, so it's worthless (Like a #8 buckshot)

What did interest me about the 223 is that it veered so wildly off course when it hit the wall, that there was no telling where it was going to end up.  At least, with my 9mm or my 45, I know it's going to go in a straight line. Yes, it's going to KEEP going through that straight line but I can have some reasonable prediction as to where it's going to end up. 

Range.
Winner-AR15
Second-shotgun
Last-pistol

But, in an indoor environment, in a house or an apt, why does range matter?



So, I don't get it. As far as I'm concerned in every category except Range (which I think is not relevant) the AR loses. However, if you DARE suggest anything other than an AR15 as a gun that everyone should own, you get massive downvotes.

What the hell am I missing?


As a note, I'm NOT anti AR15. I'm going to buy one again one day. I just think that they are literally the LAST gun that I would buy for home defense with ONE exception.

If I lived on a 50 acre ranch (or house with a large yard), and I was concerned about being invaded by zombies, mobs, or any other situations where I'd have to engage multiple targets at greater than 50 yards, then yes,  I'd want a semi auto rifle.  The only other situation I could see if if I was in the middle of a city that was at extreme risk for mob violence/riots  i.e. 'The Purge' then I might consider it.  However, that's a fringe of a fringe of a fringe... and only Detroit and Chicago come to mind. 


So, what am I missing here? Am I just over thinking this too much and I'm trying to fight a pointless war against armchair experts?
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#2
I use to put the shotgun high on the list, but since the wife and daughter has got involved with firearms, the shotgun has dropped to the bottom. They both can shot shotguns, but neither enjoy it and will avoid it. Most ladies that have shot the shotguns, don't like it. They are loud and kick hard.

It seems most ladies want to try to shot the AR. I think because they are in the news, movie, etc. they want to try one out. Generally, they do okay with them. Much easier than the shotgun.

The women's group that my wife shots with, the ladies have all ended up with pistols for their self defense need. Although three of them have purchased PCCs to go with their pistols because they live on farms and wanted something that let them reach a little further out.

To tie this all into your discussion, I'm not sure how many of those that are giving advise have actually spent time with ladies and letting ladies work through their choices. In my experience (limited group of about 20 ladies), the ladies start out wanting a little gun. You let them shot a little gun and they don't like it. Most of them didn't think they could handle a bigger gun and are surprised that they can handle it so well with a little instruction. They get very comfortable with the pistol.

So, my recommendations has been to those looking for home defense is to get a pistol that they are comfortable with and willing to practice with. Next choice is to get a PCC that goes with the pistol. After those two, add whatever you would like, but the reality is that the gun next to your bed or on your side is the one that you will reach for when something goes bump in the night.

Just my 2 cents.
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#3
(08-22-2018, 10:47 PM)ric0123 Wrote: Please, SOMEONE explain to me why an AR15 is a better home defense gun for an  22 year old girl, with limited gun experience, who lives alone in a 700 sq ft apartment, than a $150 shotgun or a $200 revolver?

So, what am I missing here? Am I just over thinking this too much and I'm trying to fight a pointless war against armchair experts?

Do you need an AR15 for home defense in the scenario you've described?  Nope.  Your logic on a shotgun or revolver or semi-auto pistol is sound, prudent, practical and logical.  I'll add a PCC like we've been discussing in the Defense section such as the Ruger PCC or Kel-Tec Sub 2K or several other examples in 9mm.

The shotgun as bmeyers stated is a very sound choice for HD...but a 12g kicks even with low recoil rounds.  I know my wife simply would not be capable of shooting it except in a dire emergency and even then it would be iffy due to physical limitations.  My son can and has shot my shotguns but it's just not on the top of his 'wanna go shoot' list.  I like it because I've used one for the last 27 years.  Whether or not it would be right for you is only something you can decided.  And of course there is 20g and even 410g to consider.  Even a .410 shotgun with the right load would be quite effective in a HD scenario.

I have several early threads on the board for SHTF gun(s).  In those threads I state that in 99% of the situations you're likely to encounter, a good revolver and a box of ammo (or better yet a speed loader or two or a couple of speed strips) will more than see you through the situation.  Nothing at all wrong with a good .38 Special.  

A semi-auto is a no-brainer for most folks in just about any caliber.  I'm going gun shopping tomorrow with a couple that I taught a couple of years ago.  They've made the decision to purchase a handgun for HD as well as to carry.  Due to several factors they've decided, at least for now, to go with a .22 semi-auto.  Many would poo-poo the .22 as a defensive handgun.  But for some with physical limitations at .22 is often the only choice or the better choice or the right choice.  I would rather a person use a .22 that they can shoot very well than a larger caliber that, for whatever reason, they can't shoot well.  

I mentioned the PCC.  I'm really digging the Kel-Tec Sub 2000.  I think I'd tend to grab it before my HD shotgun.  It's more readily accessible than my SG but also easier to shoot.  I'm thinking big picture in that the possibility exists that I could be injured yet my wife could pick up the Sub 2K and use it whereas the SG not so much.  A PCC is a viable option for HD.

So where does that leave the AR15?  Well, it's only been maybe a year and a half since I got my first one.  Just got a second one when it was offered to me in a trade.  I like the AR15 but honestly neither would be my first go-to in a HD situation in my locale.  Now like you said above, if I lived out in a rural setting on some acreage then the circumstances would dictate a different approach.  But I'm in a sub-division surrounded by other homes on all four sides.  An AR15 'generally' wouldn't be a prudent option.  Now if it was massive civil unrest with large mobs rampaging through the neighborhood then the AR15 starts to look pretty good.  That isn't high up on my list of realistic concerns except perhaps after a hurricane or something.  Normal concerns to address would be a home invasion, break in or maybe a domestic down the street gone horribly bad.  Any of that can be addressed with options other than an AR15 or AK47 or similar.  

Now I think that something along the lines of an AR15 are prudent for other considerations beyond the scope of this thread.  I'll leave it at that for now.  And the AR15 was initially described to me as the 'Barbie doll' of rifles due to all the accessories available to it.  For that reason I've really started to take an interest in the platform though I will insert the caveat that I'm not the expert on this platform like I am with revolvers, pistols and shotguns.
Governmental dependance makes for poor self reliance.

"What could possibly go wrong with a duct tape boat?"  Cody Lundin

The best defense against evil men are good men with violent skill sets.
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#4
They are legos for folk.'08.
If you look like food,you will be eaten.


I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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#5
I will use a pistol to get to my shotgun or my AR-9 pistol. I would prefer the AR-9 as it has more firepower and I can get back on target for follow up shots if necessary and it is easier to reload. I do not think of rifle caliber AR's or AK's as good home defense weapons unless shooting through a window.
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